Post by Quendil on Aug 4, 2023 12:20:00 GMT
From facebook
So, as we get closer to announcing the date for the Kickstarter, which we are just waiting for our artist to finish up his current commitments for the KS page, I wanted to share some of my thoughts when writing 2nd Edition.
When writing the rules for 2nd Edition one of the biggest challenges was finding the balance. As all of the 1stEdition veterans know the game had very little balance. This affected the game on many levels, some which were very obvious, and some were in subtle ways.
The primary imbalance issues as I saw them were:
1- The number of models on the table for either side. The Humans, generally, had at least 3 to 4 times the number of models on the table. Combined with the one side moving-shooting-moving all of their units before the other side did the same. This led to the Human turn taking considerably longer than the Martian turn.
2- Point value between the two sides were skewed in favor of the Martians to such a degree the Humans needed at least 2.5 to 3 times as many points on the table. This made the first issue even worse.
3- Army building. There was almost no structure or limitations when building your army for the tabletop. This led to spamming a particular unit, for both the Martian and to a lesser degree, the Humans and left many models on the shelf.
4- The monetary costs between the Martians and Humans. It could cost up to 10x as much to manufacture a human army than it did a Martian army and this translated directly into a higher cost to the players.
During the process of building the army you were going field on the game table you had a list to choose from depending on your army. In 1st Edition there was little structure when building your force. While this did provide maximum flexibility, unless you wanted a themed or meme army you generally spammed the best and most effective units, forgoing less optimal units.
For the Martians, the way both the general rules and the specific Martian rules were written there was virtually no reason to choose anything other than Assault Tripods of the various types. You may throw in a Scout or a Grenadier Tripod for variety. Perhaps you wanted to field a Harvester/Gatherer or Scientist if you happened to have one. But for the most part you stuck with Assaults.
For the Humans, both British and American forces, there were more options, but outside of special situations, tanks and artillery of the various varieties were your go to option. The infantry were there just to pad out your forces and provide a target for Martian heat rays.
This issue was exasperated by the fact the Human forces could not match up to the Martians on a point for point or model for model basis. On average, it took 3 to 4 times as many points worth of Humans to match the Martians. This made competitive play almost impossible. The vast majority of games we found, both in our local community but other game communities, to be narratively driven with only a passing nod to published point costs.
One of the effects of this was a Martian player had relatively few models on the table compared to Human players. This resulted in Human player turns being considerably longer than Martian player turns. In larger games with multiple people playing on both sides, especially during convention events, this could lead to Martian players having very little to actively do during a game. A Martian player may control 2 or 3 Tripods, depending on the number of players and size of the game, vs scores of tanks, infantry and artillery for the opposite Human player. I saw how this could lead to boredom, frustration or a general negative perception by some people, especially newer players.
I am sure those of you with large Human forces have noticed the effect this has had on your wallet as well. The price of an effective 3000 point Martian army, consisting of 10 or so Tripods could be purchased for around $150 if not less. A 3000 point Human army would cost…considerably more.
For Alien Dungeon the manufacturing costs, outside of mold costs, was under $5 for those 10 Assault or Scout Tripods. For humans even if you stuck with just the plastic Mk III tanks kits 3000 points cost almost triple that of the Martians. When you branch out into the resin and metal kits of most of the Human forces the manufacturing costs for humans were almost 10x the cost of Martians. This was reflected in the cost to the players.
To combat these imbalances I had to make changes.
The first step was to change some of the rules, both the universal and the particular army rules. A bit change was, instead of one entire side moving and shooting their entire army you now activate one unit then your opponent activates a unit. This goes back and forth until both sides has activated all their units. This keeps the action going at more of an equal pace for both sides.
Of course for this change to have the effect I was looking for would require both sides to have a relatively equal number of units on the table. To do this I would have to change the army composition rules and now there is now much mor structure to building your force for the battlefield.
Changing the army composition rules also required me to rebalance the effectiveness of all the units. This was to ensure all the models in your collection has a place on the battlefield and will not just sit collecting dust on your shelf. This also required me to balance the point costs to ensure both an equal number of models/units on the battlefield while maintaining their effectiveness.
Also very importantly I needed to keep in mind the manufacturing costs of both sides. As I wanted to keep the cost to the players more balanced between the Human and Martian players. I absolutely did not want a Human player paying 5x or more than a Martian player to field an army.
None of this was simple. Keeping a balance between fun narrative play, competitive play, and cost to the player was not an easy task. Even now with things being finalized I question myself as to weather I found the balance I was looking for.
As you saw in the pictures of the two starter armies for the Kickstarter, both sides have a similar number of units or models, the point costs are the same and the manufacturing costs are very close. No amount of playtesting, both in house and through my fantastic outside playtesters, can 100% find all the issues and I am sure there may need to be some rebalancing issues we have not seen once it is released into the wider community.
Enough of my rambling, how well a job my team and I did will be for you, the fans, to judge.
When writing the rules for 2nd Edition one of the biggest challenges was finding the balance. As all of the 1stEdition veterans know the game had very little balance. This affected the game on many levels, some which were very obvious, and some were in subtle ways.
The primary imbalance issues as I saw them were:
1- The number of models on the table for either side. The Humans, generally, had at least 3 to 4 times the number of models on the table. Combined with the one side moving-shooting-moving all of their units before the other side did the same. This led to the Human turn taking considerably longer than the Martian turn.
2- Point value between the two sides were skewed in favor of the Martians to such a degree the Humans needed at least 2.5 to 3 times as many points on the table. This made the first issue even worse.
3- Army building. There was almost no structure or limitations when building your army for the tabletop. This led to spamming a particular unit, for both the Martian and to a lesser degree, the Humans and left many models on the shelf.
4- The monetary costs between the Martians and Humans. It could cost up to 10x as much to manufacture a human army than it did a Martian army and this translated directly into a higher cost to the players.
During the process of building the army you were going field on the game table you had a list to choose from depending on your army. In 1st Edition there was little structure when building your force. While this did provide maximum flexibility, unless you wanted a themed or meme army you generally spammed the best and most effective units, forgoing less optimal units.
For the Martians, the way both the general rules and the specific Martian rules were written there was virtually no reason to choose anything other than Assault Tripods of the various types. You may throw in a Scout or a Grenadier Tripod for variety. Perhaps you wanted to field a Harvester/Gatherer or Scientist if you happened to have one. But for the most part you stuck with Assaults.
For the Humans, both British and American forces, there were more options, but outside of special situations, tanks and artillery of the various varieties were your go to option. The infantry were there just to pad out your forces and provide a target for Martian heat rays.
This issue was exasperated by the fact the Human forces could not match up to the Martians on a point for point or model for model basis. On average, it took 3 to 4 times as many points worth of Humans to match the Martians. This made competitive play almost impossible. The vast majority of games we found, both in our local community but other game communities, to be narratively driven with only a passing nod to published point costs.
One of the effects of this was a Martian player had relatively few models on the table compared to Human players. This resulted in Human player turns being considerably longer than Martian player turns. In larger games with multiple people playing on both sides, especially during convention events, this could lead to Martian players having very little to actively do during a game. A Martian player may control 2 or 3 Tripods, depending on the number of players and size of the game, vs scores of tanks, infantry and artillery for the opposite Human player. I saw how this could lead to boredom, frustration or a general negative perception by some people, especially newer players.
I am sure those of you with large Human forces have noticed the effect this has had on your wallet as well. The price of an effective 3000 point Martian army, consisting of 10 or so Tripods could be purchased for around $150 if not less. A 3000 point Human army would cost…considerably more.
For Alien Dungeon the manufacturing costs, outside of mold costs, was under $5 for those 10 Assault or Scout Tripods. For humans even if you stuck with just the plastic Mk III tanks kits 3000 points cost almost triple that of the Martians. When you branch out into the resin and metal kits of most of the Human forces the manufacturing costs for humans were almost 10x the cost of Martians. This was reflected in the cost to the players.
To combat these imbalances I had to make changes.
The first step was to change some of the rules, both the universal and the particular army rules. A bit change was, instead of one entire side moving and shooting their entire army you now activate one unit then your opponent activates a unit. This goes back and forth until both sides has activated all their units. This keeps the action going at more of an equal pace for both sides.
Of course for this change to have the effect I was looking for would require both sides to have a relatively equal number of units on the table. To do this I would have to change the army composition rules and now there is now much mor structure to building your force for the battlefield.
Changing the army composition rules also required me to rebalance the effectiveness of all the units. This was to ensure all the models in your collection has a place on the battlefield and will not just sit collecting dust on your shelf. This also required me to balance the point costs to ensure both an equal number of models/units on the battlefield while maintaining their effectiveness.
Also very importantly I needed to keep in mind the manufacturing costs of both sides. As I wanted to keep the cost to the players more balanced between the Human and Martian players. I absolutely did not want a Human player paying 5x or more than a Martian player to field an army.
None of this was simple. Keeping a balance between fun narrative play, competitive play, and cost to the player was not an easy task. Even now with things being finalized I question myself as to weather I found the balance I was looking for.
As you saw in the pictures of the two starter armies for the Kickstarter, both sides have a similar number of units or models, the point costs are the same and the manufacturing costs are very close. No amount of playtesting, both in house and through my fantastic outside playtesters, can 100% find all the issues and I am sure there may need to be some rebalancing issues we have not seen once it is released into the wider community.
Enough of my rambling, how well a job my team and I did will be for you, the fans, to judge.