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Post by madmorgan on Jun 24, 2016 11:16:01 GMT
Hmmm, I missed that, just assumed (yeah I know) that skirmishers could move more easily than formed troops - my bad, think Napy rules not WW1. The saving throw is a nice advantage. But, it begs the question how good skirmishers would be vs advancing Mars infantry types. The firepower is okay but the drones would have an advantage with the delay the skirmishes have reforming for assaults.
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Post by loyalist on Aug 24, 2016 21:34:28 GMT
Hmmm, I missed that, just assumed (yeah I know) that skirmishers could move more easily than formed troops - my bad, think Napy rules not WW1. The saving throw is a nice advantage. But, it begs the question how good skirmishers would be vs advancing Mars infantry types. The firepower is okay but the drones would have an advantage with the delay the skirmishes have reforming for assaults. From the BEF expansion pdf it seems the skirmishers have the same fire power as regular troops, having 3 elements. The only advantage I can see in using them is for the better save when shot at while dispersed. I'd use skirmishing units to advance, shoot and maybe retreat, or deploy them in trenches where they'll be more spread out than a standard infantry unit and less vulnerable to template weapons.
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Post by madmorgan on Aug 25, 2016 10:33:40 GMT
Yes, the big thing with the skirmishers is the save. I have a hard time envisioning skirmishes in trenches. Its an excellent game tactic, just feels like they aren't really doing a 'skirmish' action in a trench. That said a 3 element squad in skirmish formation in a trench is probably one of the best defenses the poor infantry will get besides the Fortress Wall.
Def +4 Armor +2 Save 7+ takes up three times size of trench and with 'blip' status takes at least a second shot to actually chance a hit. With the BEF you only get 2 elements worth - but, one of those has a 1/2 pdr coil gun.
The real stretch is Armored/Assault Infantry in skirmish formation - adding Gas Immune and a +1 rifle to the above (with only a 10" range).
The real problem with all of the skirmish/trench troops is that they can be overrun very easily in that formation and without the usual trench defense bonus. If you have the time to reform, better. But, the weakness of a trench line is as always the assault phase. If you've not taken out advancing drones, they'll get you in the trench. In as much as the skirmish trench troop gets better chances (through surviving fire) to shot up said drones, this might be a valid tactic - it needs play testing folks.
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Post by tenchuu on Aug 25, 2016 15:24:59 GMT
I'd never considered them as anything other than... You know, skirmishers. Harassing. By skirmishing. Putting them in trenches seems backwards. You could always just say they lose their skirmish bonus if in trenches.
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Post by loyalist on Aug 25, 2016 16:02:52 GMT
If dispersed in skirmish formation a unit would need 490 mm ( 6 x 40 mm bases plus 5 gaps of 50 mm between them) of trench versus 400 mm for a normal infantry unit. The AQ trench sets are just long enough for one unit of normal infantry with 50mm/2" gaps between the 3 elements.
I think I'll base the Blue Moon British infantry as regular troops (Canadian militia/home defense troops) instead of militia, and put them in trenches due to their lower armour value.
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Post by madmorgan on Aug 25, 2016 20:55:57 GMT
Yikes that is a change! Heck, price of a bag of 50 with the 'Army' discount of 40%, you could probably get two sets, one of regulars and one of militia. Wait, you've got that postage thing there; sorry.
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Post by loyalist on Oct 6, 2016 19:15:31 GMT
The Blue Moon British Infantry Advancing arrived today. I deleted 4 prone figures firing rifles and 4 figures carrying what could be a doctor's bag - those will be added to command teams. The prone figures would have required a wider than standard base.
I had enough spares from the British command pack (4 officers waving pistols and 8 sergeants carrying rifles and pointing (4 types)) to bring the number of figures up to 54. That's enough for two 24 man units of Canadian Home Guard Skirmishers and two 15 man units of regular troops. Looks like I'll be trying out some skirmishing units after all.
I've cut off the bayonets to reduce accidental bending of the rather long bayonet/rifle combo and reduce the chance of them being broken off. With the bayonets removed only a few rifle ends project beyond the 20mm wide bases.
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Post by madmorgan on Oct 7, 2016 9:17:19 GMT
I think those were meant to be ammo boxes for LMG or MGs. Let me check for my own curiosity.
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Post by madmorgan on Oct 7, 2016 9:53:42 GMT
Okay I was right - the fellows are with ammo box to be paired with the advancing LMG (Lewis style) from the pack with the MG (3 man). You get 8 each of the MG stand and single advancing LMG. I really like that as you can justify the LMG figure as full RoF and a team. Ty!
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Post by loyalist on Oct 12, 2016 2:41:08 GMT
It seems only the British have units that can skirmish: Ghurkas and Home Defense units. Does anyone know how long the skirmisher bases are supposed to be? Probably the standard 20mm wide but the rules don't say if the length is 50 mm (1/2 the length of a standard infantry element base) or only 40mm because there are only 2 figures per base and two combine to form an element when not skirmishing. I'm thinking of adding a unit of Ghurkas to my BEF force, and maybe some frontier skirmishing units to my Canadian force. I was also wondering about the dimensions of the base sizes. I couldn't make out if they were 40mm by 20mm. I would really like to see some Gurkhas not sure on the models to use. Now that I've just finished applying basing material to 3 units of Skirmishers on 20 x 40mm bases, I've reread the BEF supplement about them. Stupidly I hadn't measured the proportions of the skirmisher bases in the diagram earlier when we were wondering about base size. Having done so just now they would scale up to 20mm x 48mm so were clearly meant to represent 2 figures on a 50mm base, not the 20mm x 40mm bases I used. I'm debating whether to re-base the units, which will mean a few hours of extra work and ordering more 20 x 100mm Renedra bases to cut in half.
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Post by madmorgan on Oct 12, 2016 9:57:53 GMT
Okay I do recall mentioning the 20 x 50 mm as one option. Well, you could always use the troops you've already based for regular units needed in less than 100 mm lengths (my usual 2 40x20 + 1 20x20 being a squad) and do a new set of 50 mm style. The other use for your done work is to use them as extra guards, support for HQ units or as Forward Observers till we have some good figures (come BM get those new observation figures done!) for FOs. Just a thought.
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Post by loyalist on Oct 12, 2016 14:40:04 GMT
I soaked all of the units overnight and dissolved the basing material. All bases have been lengthened from 40 mm to 50 mm with 1.5 mm thick strip styrene. I added 2.5 mm at one end, which gave the correct distance from the end for the nearest figure, so I only have to re-position 1 figure per base. They do look better on a 50 mm base, being further apart than regular infantry. On the 40 mm bases the spacing was identical to the regulars.
I'll trim the edges of the styrene strips this evening and apply the basing material again.
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Post by loyalist on Oct 13, 2016 15:31:20 GMT
The first 3 units of skirmishers have been re-based and the Liquitex basing material and fine railway ballast reapplied. They look much better on 50 mm long bases. Between the Blue Moon British Command and Advancing Infantry packs I had enough figures to make a 4th unit of skirmishers, some command squads and have 4 pairs of prone and kneeling riflemen to base as sniper teams.
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Post by madmorgan on Oct 13, 2016 17:39:16 GMT
Excellent use of figures and I look forward to the final pics of your skirmishers. I'm sure your right that the 50 mm bases standout for the skirmishers as opposed to the 40x20s. Sounds like you got 'full value' from your mix of figures and do hope to do some of my own soon.
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